Until we get that big chunk of money it will always be like that…it is what it is…
“Bigger” is completely relative; let me put it in perspective. A lot of conferences are very top heavy and rely on the better programs to carry the image of the conference. However, all conferences have at least 1 or 2 teams where we ask ourselves the perplexing question “what are you doing?”, every year. lol Furthermore,
Big 10
-Rutgers
-Purdue
-Indiana
Big 12
-Kansas
-Iowa State
-Texas Tech
SEC
-Mississippi State
-Vanderbilt
-Kentucky
ACC
-Boston College
-Syracuse
-Duke
-Wake Forest
Pac 12
-Arizona
-Washington State
Oregon State
the previous are all teams that would have trouble winning the AAC, annually (based on recent level of success and team talent). We are closer to a P5 than a group of 5.
You could easily expand that list. Colorado, Minnesota, Okst just off the top of my head.
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That’s true. lol
I am huge UH fan, I donate and have season tickets to several UH sports. Heck I even hire UH grads and have a UH intern program to give students real world experience. However, I am a realist as well. I would be shocked if UH were invited to a P5 conference. If it were going to happen it would have happened already. I also would be shocked if AAC were elevated to P6. I just dont think the money is there but maybe I am wrong. Maybe Aresco knows something I dont. Lets just be the best G5 program we can be. That is not a bad lot in life.
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I don’t mind Aresco challenging the P5/G5 stratification with fabricated P6 because all of this is fabricated. There is no officially sanctioned Power 5 grouping of schools, likewise G5. There are conferences and the $network$ deals with ESPN/Fox, and that is it. The conspiracy theorist in me points to the fact that the network deals that ESPN has made have damaged rivalries and/or destroyed conferences outright. Schools in the B12 scattering like roaches to other conferences due to the LHN (Nebraska, Colorado, A&M, Missouri)? Rutgers in the B10? WV in the B12? ESPN is in a mess and would like nothing more than to further ruin CFB by creating a P4 and a G5 playoff/championship for their own purposes…rivalries and regional matchups be damed. The very things that make CFB great.
NCAA is toothless in this mess.
Why not P6?
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If the Big 12 can have 10 schools, why can’t the AAC call itself Power 6? Wait. What if we changed the name of the conference to Power 6?
Are you hiring or may i intern? =D
I think Aresco approaching “Silicon Valley” is a great move. I could see an Amazon or Hulu deal for live sports content be pretty lucrative. I for one would stream every UH event.
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The issue isn’t winning, never really has been in college football. The issue is putting butts in seats, getting TV ratings, academics and donations. UH’s academics are heading in the right direction and the TV ratings are trending upwards as long as we keep winning.
Attendance has always been a struggle. Last year, we actually outdrew 9 P5 schools, but we have to keep that going. We have to get to the point that a 40K stadium is too small; we’re not there yet and fans disappear too often when things aren’t going great (i.e. UCF last year or the crowds in 2014 after losing to UTSA).
Donations were at around $8M+ for the '15-'16 school year which is much better than it had been, but puts us behind East Carolina, Fresno State, Boise State, UNLV, Memphis, San Diego State, and all P5’s except for Washington State among non-private schools. Most P5’s are receiving close to or more than $20M each year.
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But you’re absolutely right. It’s going to huge. That negotiation will probably take place early 2019, which is … Heck, it’s not even a year and a half away, essentially. In addition, we have to do … We’ll talk to ESPN in '18 to see whether, maybe, they want to redo the deal, and that’s going to depend. A lot of it’s just revenue at this point. We need more revenue, and we think we can generate more revenue because we’re far more valuable. Doing those Thursday/Fridays is valuable. Not everybody can do those games. You saw some of the bigger conferences kind of rebel when they were asked to do it. Our guys know who they are, and they’re willing to do it. But TV is absolutely … it’s the premier concern right now.
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How do you beat a cartel or how can you be part of the cartel? Again and again Aresco can talk all he wants but he was part of the G5’s capitulating to the P5’s. Right now, the highest-ranked Group of Five champion is under contract to play in the Cotton, Fiesta or Peach Bowl through the 2025 regular season. After this date your guess is as good as mine. You can be sure that the P5’s will want to further extend their monopoly.
The “Bowl coalition” started in 1992. This was the beginning of the end to the G5’s.
Our 1988 probation lasted until 1991. Just pause for a moment about the impact that it caused to our program? Andre won the Heisman against all odds and we were not on TV. uta and atm knew very well what they were doing at that time. Put the giant in a bottle. The ass whipping that we gave Oklahoma reminded everyone of what our program can do. Some of us complain that we had low attendance in the 80’s and 90’s. How many probation did we get? When you get you legs whipped constantly it killed any types of momentum.
espn blocked us from entering the small12. Did they really or was this orchestrated?
judarman leaves for uta. Coincidence?
uta supported our entry into the small12 then nothing? Coincidence?
70’s and 80’s probation pushed by uta and atm. Coincidence?
We have no choice but to broker any types of deal to join a P5. Buy our way into the PAC12 or BIG10? Every option I am sure is or has been considered. We need to keep at it.
Unfortunately the days of BYU winning the big salad bowl are over. The CFP will never allow it.
Truth being spoken here. We need to keep growing the fanbase and I believe we will, with the focus of students living on campus and nearby. The continued development of the East Side and Third Ward. The rail system which allows students and others to easily travel to other parts of town without need of a car. And of course, the stadium on campus. UH does not look anything like it looked 10 years ago. Guess what. UH, the East Side, and Third Ward do not look anything today like they will look in 10 more years.
It is why I am concerned but not worried about the future. The future looks great and I believe our donations levels and fanbase will continue to grow. And at some point, one of the P5 conferences is going to make the play. In my mind, when UT decides where they are going, we will get picked up by one of the others. They are all waiting on the prize, in their mind, which is UT. Reality, the long-term prize just might be UH.
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ESPN and UTA (due to Abbott) were on board with adding Houston and BYU if expansion was a go. FOX, however, was not on board with it as they wanted east coast teams. The two networks were not willing to budge so expansion was killed and the two networks closed the loophole to avoid possible expansion until the contract was up.
As far as the playoffs, who knows. Yes, Aresco voted for the P5/G5 split, but the other option was the P5 schools creating their own division or even breaking away from the NCAA. At the time, the AAC was in no position to fight it.
I respectfully disagree Patrick. Abbott seemed to be on board but uta itself could have “brokered” a deal. Fox not wanting U of H and the Houston market? What about Fox bringing us & BYU an invite into another P5 like the BIG10 and have their East Coast teams? I understand that we do not meet the BIG10 criteria right now but they have made exceptions. When there is a will there is a way. Until we do get an invite back into a P5 I will still think that we are being excluded for one reason. Our enormous potential is a major threat to many. I would venture that the entire Texas and OK teams were against us joining. Put yourself in their shoes. A huge number of their recruits comes from our turf.
The G5 could have taken their plea to congress and won. Instead they got scared that they could not survive unless they made a deal with the devil.
Utah is the precedent in all of this. Orrin Hatch made the argument/htreat of anti trust laws. I remember how vocal he was at the time.
The CFP was created…AFTER Orin Hatch threatened them and…the Utah Utes are now part of the PAC12. On this G5 vs P5 issue we have not heard Mr. Hatch since then.
There is still a clear indication of an anti-trust issue here. The question is how strong are the G5’s taking their case to the justice department? I suspect that there is a huge P5 lobby behind this.
Would Mr. Fertitta and other major heavyweights join forces to pursue this avenue? They might not have a choice to do so. Let’s assume that we do not get invited when the next tv contracts are up for grabs then what? Can we wait another 20 years for another round of tv contracts? We have to face reality and keep winning big and sell out games.
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Texas couldn’t broker with FOX, they are an ESPN entity. FOX didn’t want BYU because they are also an ESPN entity as well as being in an area well covered by other FOX conferences (B1G and Pac12) and didn’t want Houston for the same reason. FOX badly wanted expansion on the east coast by either grabbing UCONN or the two Florida schools. ESPN, owners of the SEC and ACC, didn’t want to allow FOX further expansion into the east coast. There was no deal to broker as neither side wanted to compromise for the other. The schools really have no say in the expansion process anymore; haven’t for a long time.
The G5 wouldn’t have won this time around. The main basis of the argument last time was that the non-BCS teams had no access to BCS bowls. That was remedied by putting Utah into the Pac 12 while also allowing for non-BCS teams access if they had higher rankings than a BCS conference; there was now a path. That continued into the playoff era as there are no restrictions on who the playoff teams can be and the highest ranked G5 school is given a spot in a NY6 bowl. There are also no restrictions on at-large spots. It may not be completely fair, but the main thing is that there are no restrictions which was good enough for Congress.
Unfortunately, you’d have to find a senator from a football-crazed state that doesn’t have a P5 team already to try to take up a new fight…and there just aren’t any out there. Even if you do find one, the P5 cartel has already said that they would split from the NCAA if forced to give-in anymore…which they have every right to do so. That’s the last thing any of the other schools in the NCAA want because they all would lose tons of money, not just from football, but from the NCAA tourney. Again, when it comes to the NCAA, it isn’t just P5 and G5 conferences, it’s every conference.
Mr. Fertitta is doing everything he can to get UH into a P5 conference, and was on the verge of it until the networks got involved. He’d be fighting a losing battle by trying to take it to Congress, though, as we wouldn’t have enough support in our own state. Now, his brothers out in Nevada may be able to get something done, but that won’t help Houston much if suddenly UNLV or Nevada ends up in a P5.
Can we wait another 20 years? I don’t know. I’m constantly worried that at some point the administration is going to have to pull the plug on the excess spending that we’ve been doing for the last decade or that Ms. Khator leaves and our next president takes us back to the mid-90s. All we can do is put ourselves in the best position possible when the next round hits or hope that the TV bubble bursts and conferences eventually have to return to their regional roots. That’s why I’ve said in another thread that 7-5 or 8-4 this year would be disastrous; the program would take two steps back to the Levine years if that happened. It’s a tough situation that doesn’t provide a lot of room for leeway, but we’ve never had that much to begin with and have made it this far.
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There isn’t going to be movement until about 2023. UH needs to be positioned at that point for P5 academically and athletically. Frankly, we are more likely to end up with P4 than P6 at that time. Texas, OU, Kansas are definitely gone from the Big 12. Then you have the remaining seven schools available to be plucked by the other conferences. At that point, UH hopefully presents a more attractive add than Baylor, TCU, Texas Tech, etc.
Very well thought out, Pat.
Orin Hatch forced Utah to get into the PAC12 by his own power vs the P5. Utah should have won the National trophy or at least get a share of it like BYU did in 1984. The P5 put up a huge fight but they knew they could not win against the DOG on the basis of an anti trust issue. The same can be argued today. If Hatch had not put his weight behind it the Utes would still be in MWC. The P5 act as if they portray this unified front but what would happen if federal funds are cut off to them? How many P5 sports program will survive if DC cuts the Debit Card?
How many P5 sports program are sustainable on their own? Tuition can only go so high. Look no further than the PAC12 or even the small12. How would the P5 members besides Alabama, uta or a few others would react if DC threatened to cut off any financial aid? You would have a rebellion in a heartbeat. The pendulum is pointing one way. Most P5 Schools/programs are hurting for funds. They are simply unsustainable without financial aid. Do you think that even the wealthiest Football Schools would want a financial audit?
Here is a quick list of the leading Senators:
Republicans:
V.P. Pence, Hanover - U of Wi
Hatch, Utah
John Cornyn, UVA; Thune, USD; Barrasso, G.Town; Blunt, Missou St.; Gardner, CSU & UofCo; Lee, BYU; Crapo, BYU
Democrats:
Schumer, Harvard; Durbin, G.Town; Murrau, WSU; Stabenow, MSU; Warner. GWU; Warren, U of H - Rutgers; Klobuchar, Yale; Sanders, UofCh; Manchin, WV (football scholarship); Baldwin, U of Wi; Van Hollen, Hardvard; Merkley, Stanford; Leahy, G.Town
It is fun to argue but as you can see the vast majority of key Senators are affiliated with non-P5 Schools.
Would BYU want to buy out their espn contract if they get a chance to join a P5? I would think so.
I grant you this is potentially a huge legal fight and we could not go at it alone. We all fail to recognize that this current G5 vs P5 is actually very recent. It only originated in 1992 and was “cemented” when the CFP was created just a couple of years ago.
2025 is huge for the G5. When that contract is up then what? Will the P5 renew that contract to keep the G5 at bay?
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Chris, I agree with you on what should happen; I just don’t see it happening. Even if there was a push to try and get congressional help, I’m not sure they would be willing to take it up due to the current political climate and there may not be an opportunity for quite awhile until things, hopefully, settle down.
G5 schools could file a lawsuit instead, possibly arguing anti-trust (Note: I’m not a lawyer so I may be way off), but that would be hard to prove and would probably get shot down by the Supreme Court if it ever made it that far based on the current leanings of the justices.
Going back to the Utah scenario, they had national publicity because the public thought they deserved a shot. Unfortunately, in the CFP era, no G5 has been able to put themselves in that position to test it out. We had a chance last year, but, you know…good ole Traitor Tom left us high and dry. Maybe USF (or us 
) can win out and see what happens. USF’s problem is that their schedule is ridiculously terrible that no one will respect them if they do go undefeated. Houston going undefeated would at least be something to think about since our schedule I see decent.
If we’re truly stuck in a non-power conference, I’d hope the best of the non power schools sit down and try to build a best of the rest conference. Pull 20 schools together, 2 divisions, winners play each other for a guaranteed NY6 slot. If we can pull BYU, Boise, Air Force, Army, and the best of the rest of the MWC while also pulling the best of the AAC, maybe it would be enough for one of the at-large bowls to go for it.