An actual distrubance in the force

No. Likely part of the build back better and several other pieces of legislation passed during the previous admin. Huge economic boons provided to those who manufacture in the states from said legislation.

Clarification: this manufacturing boon is aimed specifically at energy. Specifically vehicles, batteries, generation, etc.

Clarification edit: looks to have been the inflation reduction act and SEMA (Solar Energy Manufacturing for America Act)

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We’ve the 2nd lowest consumer sentiment since 1952.

It was lowest reading since June 2022 and the second lowest in the survey’s history going back to 1952.

Sentiment declines came across all demographics, including age, income and political affiliation, according to Joanne Hsu, the survey director.

“Consumers report multiple warning signs that raise the risk of recession: expectations for business conditions, personal finances, incomes, inflation, and labor markets all continued to deteriorate this month,” Hsu said.

Will University of Michigan federal funding be held up with this report ?

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I found this thread on X. Thought it was interesting

Karl Mehta
(https://x.com/karlmehta)

Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent’s new interview just went viral. He exposed the truth about He who cannot be named’s tariff plan: It’s not about a trade war…it’s about completely redistributing American wealth. Here’s what you missed about He who cannot be named’s $750B gamble (& what will happen next):
Bill Ackman and 4 others

First, here’s what just happened: After announcing aggressive tariffs last week, 75+ countries scrambled to call the White House. China retaliated - their tariffs immediately jumped to 125%. Everyone else? A 90-day pause with 10% baseline tariffs. And it was all calculated…

Bessent revealed the first layer: debt management. $9.5 trillion needs refinancing in 2025. Market volatility pushed investors toward Treasury bonds. Yields dropped below 4%, saving billions in interest. Tariffs aren’t just trade policy - they’re fiscal strategy.


Image


Image

[

Lower interest costs help, but won’t fix $36T in debt. The second part of the plan: slashing spending.

@elonmusk

&

@DOGE

cutting $4B daily - heading toward $1T in savings by September (if not sooner).

“He who cannot be named created maximum negotiating leverage.” Countries that didn’t retaliate got rewards. China kept escalating and faces 125% tariffs. The Art of the Deal playing out on global stage.

Who’s first in line to negotiate? Vietnam meeting today. Japan sending a deal team. South Korea, India at the front. “China’s neighbors” rushing to Washington’s table.

The most fascinating part of Bessent’s strategy? How it transforms global alliances. Vietnam, Japan, South Korea, and India are first in line for negotiations. Asian nations—China’s neighbors—are being pulled into America’s economic orbit.

The challenges are significant: • Short-term market volatility • Potential inflation as costs rise • Disruption to global supply chains • Retaliation from affected countries But Bessent sees beyond these concerns to the long-term structural realignment.

“For decades Republicans and Democrats have said unfair trade practices are ripping off the American people, but nobody has ever done anything.” If successful, this creates: • Manufacturing revival • Balanced global trade • Stronger national security • Lower borrowing costs

This $600B gamble is bold, disruptive, and risky. After decades of globalization that hollowed out American industry, the status quo wasn’t working for everyday Americans. The next 90 days will determine if this economic reset delivers the promised results.

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The talking points for this are all over the place and change daily.

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I’m not seeing that; others have written the reason Liberty Day tariffs were retracted, except on China and Canada, is the bond market jitters.

But he pointed specifically to the bond market as demand for U.S. Treasurys dropped and interest rates saw a steep increase.

We need folks to buy our bonds. Having to have higher rates doesn’t help us
on the financial side. Anyway, have a read of this article and see if your faith
still holds.

https://tinyurl.com/3666f68x

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That is a big statement you make here.
We have no choice to take actions now. Facts do not lie. Do you all know how we came to this?
Let’s take a trip through memory lane and with facts.
P.S: I can’t use po…s names so please read between the dots.
N…n opened the door to p.r.o.c to enter the Western market. This happened in 1972. Prior to that we favored Taiwan. The same Taiwan that won its independence. The p.r.o.c. can claim it is theirs. It is clearly not.
2000 p.r.o.c. enters the WTO. The official statement was:
“It would open new markets, provide opportunities for American businesses and create high wage for American workers”
What has happened since 1970?

Here is a graph that is easy for everyone to understand. This graph is to 2023.

How many U.S. factories have left the U.S. since the 1970’s? Anyone living in PA, WV, NC, SC, Wisconsin, OH and many other states have seen towns historically known for manufacturing become ghosts towns.
Another way to look at this is through how much has the p.r.o.c. stolen intellectual properties?
All Western industries have cried FOUL for decades…without doing a damn thing about it.
How many Western (including U.S.) universities are being funded by p.r.o.c. companies? It is one of the biggest dirty secrets that no one wants to talk about. Oh remember when the p.r.o.c. Houston consulate was raided a few years back? Remember when the same consulate workers were burning data? What did they have to hide?
Coming back to your statement about isolating ourselves.
The same p.r.o.c asked Australia, Japan, E.U. and others to join them to combat T…p. NONE accepted to join them.
Why?
Because we are the world’s largest consumer economy and it is not even close. All world economies need the U.S. to consume their products.
Isolating ourselves? The actual opposite is happening. The only country to keep its retaliations is…wait for it…the p.r.o.c.
Who has the largest trade deficit with us? Wait for it…the p.r.o.c.
By doing so T…p has isolated…wait for it…the p.r.o.c.
It is about f…ing time. Mr. Wonderful has it right. Our tariffs against the p.r.o.c. should be elevated to 400%. The same p.r.o.c. has ripped us off for decades. Like buffoons we let them do it. Meanwhile more towns became ghosts towns. Meanwhile these same towns turned into fentanyl prime target markets. That is the dirty secret that no one wants to talk about. This is why we are doing this.
I am all for free trade or reciprocal trade. Without our p…s not being bought out the same p.r.o.c. would not even come close to the behemoth economy that it became. We did this to ourselves.
They have no choice but to deal with us. Why?..because the p.r.o.c. is not a consumer economy.
Oh furthermore, this is now public the same p.r.o.c. was known to steal our trade secrets as late as this past November. You all, it is f…g time that we are doing this.

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It was the opposite of yours. So guess same to you.

I stand by my statement though.

We have lots of choices. Who chose one of them.

Who said they do? And what fact have I disregarded?

Yes, we started a trade war.

The rest of your post is an attempted lecture about trade deficits. I have a fundamental disagreement with you about what they mean.

I don’t think trade deficits are inherently bad. I have a personal trade deficit with my local grocery store but not worried about because I don’t want to grow my own food. You can choose to worry about such things. I don’t.

Also, this isn’t all about China. If it were, we wouldn’t have “reciprocal” tariffs on other countries or the flat tariff across the board. If it were just China, I may feel differently but it’s not. So we can’t focus just there.

I know you think others don’t understand things but you’re wrong. I understand economics and finance pretty well. I went to school for it and continue to work in this space. I’ve made a pretty good career of it too.

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Also, disguising politicians’ names is still breaking the rules. You’re not the only one doing so but I do ask that we stop with it.

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First thought was that’s hilarious… then it made me sad

Again you are missing the point. T…p by actions has brought the countries to the negotiation table. By his brilliant moves he has isolated the p.r.o.c. That was the end game all along. The p.r.o.c. is manufacturing goods. They are not a consumer economy, never have been. These are key points to this entire trade war. By isolating them and get our allies closer to us he is redistributing the entire manufacturing/consumer/Eco balance of power. Let’s assume your point was correct. These nations would have come to the p.r.o.c. rescue. They did the opposite.
Our trade deficit with other countries than the p.r.o.c. needed to be adjusted for decades. The E.U. knows it. That is why they were given 90 days to work it out.
We can’t afford to be dependent of the p.r.o.c. #1 it is a security threat, #2 it signals the Dollar demise, #3 who are our allies?

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I’m not missing any point. I just disagree with yours. I don’t feel the same way about trade deficits. That’s the point that’s being missed. I know a lot more than you think I do.

And I’ve asked that you stop naming politicians.

rtcoog “I know a lot more than you think I do” Let’s tone it down a bit, ok?
Disagree with me, all good with me.
Naming politicians? Do you want to erase the entire thread?
Come on now.

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The 72 accord was never meant for what we have today. They and we all know who that is played the Western Economic world like kindergartens. In reality we all know that the economic world is constantly evolving. Adjusting these tariffs is long overdue. Someone has the cojones to do it…FINALLY.

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Nothing to tone down. You continue to lecture me like I don’t understand stuff. I’m responding to that.

Nothing disrespectful in what I said at all. Weird thing to take offense to.

That’s all I’m doing.

Read what I said above. I know you’re not the only one but I specifically asked you and others to stop. You then immediately decided to do it again. Not cool.

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You’re no fraud.
:wink:

Trade is complicated and only using a measuring stick of trade deficits, is a bit
oversimplified imho. Nevertheless, there are valid reasons why countries do not
accept our ag products. Like process of dipping chickens in bleach or growing of GMO produce, or use of hormones to stimulate milk production and growth. And use of antibiotics in livestock feeds. We do all those things to maximize profits and get higher yields.

On non ag stuff it’s a mixed bag as well. Who would want to have their children
work in non air conditioned textile mills ? Same goes for producing appliances.

On software we probably do pretty well versus RoW.

Service jobs are, in one sense, just “cleaner” and more desirable imho; which is what we largely are. And it has continued to provide us with a #1 economy for decades ( we have been even since the opening of the East) .

I’m somewhat amazed people want to risk all that for the older manufacturing jobs.
I suspect some people just don’t like the idea that other countries are catching up to us. Maybe they long for the post WW2 era when our industry was untouched due to a war.

GDP per capita we are doing very well.

GNI we are still in top ten

I find it odd we are focusing on hating our success and accepting this victim posture.

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I suppose with that response you are trying to say we have a wealth
distribution problem ?

I’d agree with that point, if that’s what you’re trying to say, but that problem has
little to do with trade and tariffs. Lets address the real problem.

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I like that statement.

Let’s go ahead and extend it to cover all bases.

None of your problems are because someone else is trans, Black, Jewish, Muslim, Satanic, gay, lesbian, or undocumented.

If only we could all accept that and focus on ACTUAL problems.

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