Expansion Link Dump - September 28th

Poop hit the fan today after Thamel’s article yesterday. Even got Boren on record again today and then T. Boone spoke up creating even more hysteria. What did we learn, not much really as we’re back where we were in July when everyone thinks the Big 12 will announce that no expansion will happen…except, well, we’re still talking about it now.

Oklahoma president David Boren still undecided on Big 12 expansion
Jake Trotter

“I do not know where the speculation came from,” Boren said in a statement to ESPN, “but Oklahoma has not yet taken a position on expansion.”

To actually accomplish expansion, if that’s what the league wants to do, the appropriate players should get in a room, discuss it and decide who to invite. The leaks, the backtracking, the floating the trial balloons in the media … not the way to accomplish a goal.

“I’ve known David forever. He likes to talk. He gets a little bit confused sometimes,” Pickens said. He also suggested “maybe it’s time for David to retire.”

T. Boone Pickens, Oklahoma State coach Mike Gundy seem to be butting heads again

For the record, Pickens prefers 10 teams in the league. But there’s another interesting nugget from Pickens as it pertains to his relationship with Oklahoma State coach Mike Gundy. In addition to dissing Oklahoma’s athletic director – “maybe it’s time for David [Boren] to retire” – Pickens told Bohls he doesn’t have conversations with Gundy anymore.

If the Big 12 doesn’t expand, there’s no bigger loser than Houston

The point being, the timing of Thamel’s piece is terrible for a program that wants to elevate its national status and keep its coach. Herman stands to get a $5 million bonus if Houston is promoted to a Power Five conference. No promotion, no bonus. No bonus, and it may be tough to keep Herman from taking a bigger job elsewhere.

The Big 12 might not expand after all, but it technically didn’t promise it would

It might seem like the Big 12 can’t make up its mind — that’s been the case before — but it worded its July expansion announcement cautiously enough that it could now choose not to expand without contradicting itself.

Bohls: OSU’s Pickens disses Boren, Gundy; Formula 1 is banking on Swift

T. Boone Pickens said he likes the current 10-team Big 12 configuration the way it is and would prefer adding Houston and SMU if the league grows, but that’s “probably unlikely.”

Tramel: OU not anti-expansion; OU is anti-expansion candidates

“The teams we need have left,” another Big 12 administrator said Tuesday. “Whoever you add out there really devalues the whole conference. They don’t add anything. Just to get 12? What’s sacred about a number? Does that make you stable?”

Boren’s board of regents and the Sooners fan base had been skeptical of expansion beyond BYU and even the Big 12 in general, sources indicate.

But sources cautioned that Boren, a former Oklahoma governor and U.S. Senator, is fully capable of changing his mind on issues multiple times.

Kevin Haskin: OU president continues to hurt Big 12 with indecisiveness

■ After once claiming the league was “psychologically disadvantaged’’ with just 10 members, Boren now apparently desires no expansion, according to a recent Sports Illustrated piece.

■ Next week, who knows? But if the attempt is to get the Big 12 to dissolve, just leave.

■ It would be wonderful to see OU attempt to compete in, oh, the SEC West.

■ At some point, Oklahoma and Texas should recognize the competitive landscape which features, and favors, them as Big 12 members.

Has the off button been pressed for Big 12 expansion?

It also contributes to the dysfunction of the Big 12 and especially Boren, who has guided the expansion conversation for nearly two years.

Big 12 expansion movement reportedly losing steam

Houston and Cincinnati appear to be the favorites according to Thamel with BYU losing steam with concerns surrounding the school’s honor code and how it sees homosexual behavior as a violation.

Twitter Musings
Just going to paste the in timeline order instead of grouped by author. Kind of shows the insanity of the writers to try and one up each other as soon as the info comes out

Its a mess trying to unravel all the conflicting messages being generated … and no doubt more will be generated as 10/17 gets closer.

They all sound legitimate but they all can’t be true …

Basically its ALL centering around the sooners and some with OKlite

Boren is flip-flopping … Pickens is torpedoing OKlite relations with OU plus his own HC … OU may or may not be a B1G target and the SEC may not be all its build up to be if the sooners finish in the middle of the west pack every year.

All moi can state is that the Big12 little eight is also hearing all this and unless they act in unison then the end is near as usual unless they side with the horns WHO BTW have been fairly steady and consistent through all this … save 'course Monty’s rumor about UT + BYU and UH + ? hooking (sorry for the pun) it to another conference if expansion is kaput.

Monty is not the only one saying something like that…Other sources have said there is a huge break between Texas and OU…Texas has long preferred to be in a richer, more high profile, more stable conference. OU’s idiocy in blocking or creating problems through the whole expansion process has created the justification Texas needs as a reason to leave, if expansion doesnt happen.
Texas will take a block of schools and make a deal with PAC or BIG…They were always going to do that,Now it will come sooner rather than later. If no Big 12 expansion, look for Texas, Houston, Tech and a 4th school, maybe TCU, to make a move.

All bets should be off once those presidents sit in that board room. Got a feeling this is all posturing; once they sit in that room, they’ll come up with something. The last thing it will be is the status quo.

In the end, got a feeling even mighty OU will come around. Russo was right; what good does finishing 3rd in the SEC West do for them. Go SEC and that conference gets another foothold into your recruiting grounds while you really gain nothing except a few extra dollars. Maybe fluge is right and the B1G goes after them; great, you are now the outlier in that conference both in distance and education. Are Texas kids going to come to your school and then travel that far for games? Cool, maybe you get Ohio State and Michigan, or maybe you get home games against Minnesota, Illinois, Purdue, etc (Lot of crap at the bottom of that conference). Either way, the power you will have in those conferences is nothing compared to what they have now. Think twice before giving it up.

That’s absolutely right. If OU goes to the B1G, what happened to Nebraska is a best case scenario (they had a “national brand” too, if you’re old enough to remember the 90s). They can kiss kids from Texas goodbye.

Really this whole Houston stealing their recruits (if they were entitled to them) thing is backwards anyway: if you want to recruit them, you need to expose them to your school. You need to play where they are. Nebraska is the perfect example of that. Once Nebraska quit playing in Texas, the pipeline was shut off, and they have been pretty moribund ever since.

1 Like

Excellent analogy, jollyroger!

Nebraska also fired a coach who never got fewer than 9 wins. There are bigger issues there, like LSU, but they look better this year.

As for the plan b for Texas to take other Texas schools with us and BYU, it doesn’t say which…or how many…Texas schools. It could seriously be UT, Tech, and UH, with BYU, as a neat package of four. Much easier for the Pac to absorb, and they only have to take one religious school…the one nearest to them, with lots of on field history with several current teams, and best list of positives to offer a conference. It also works because most Pac fans say that expansion is only reasonable if it includes UT.

Don’t forget about Colorado to pac 12 and somewhat Arkansas until A&M joined Sec that they start getting Texas/Houston recruits again. OU and Okie Lite will be in the same category if they leave the B12. Worse for Okie lite since they don’t and can’t recruit nationally like OU.

I keep trying to talk myself out of Monty’s theory as not making much sense, but I so badly want to believe him that I keep searching for ways to make it make sense. Compare the two tweets below and it seems like something is happening behind the scenes.

I don’t know how much Gogets really knows, but it’s intriguing in light of what Monty keeps saying. Oh, the drama!

I am not super connected, nor do I pretend to be.

I have heard some things I won’t repeat because 1) I don’t know their accuracy, and/or 2) don’t want to screw things up. But yes, I believe Jared is right.

There are a lot of great people in the university working behind the scenes to succeed and they don’t get enough credit.


I absolutely believe something like that will happen if Big 12 doesnt expand…Some major deal with PAC or BIG could be brewing…they are waiting just like we are…

And both of those conferences are at least double the intelligence of the big 12 each, so it wouldn’t surprise me if they already have something planned and we all don’t know about it because the obvious smart choice would be to not be public about it. The Big 12 didn’t grace us with that favor and have now completely shot any chance of looking stable as a conference.

I don’t think it will be PAC or B1G if it happens. Remember, both BYU and UT are ESPN properties.

Couple more tweets from yesterday:

Twitter musings

One forgets that not only are the Lil 8 involved should the conference crater/implode if no expansion but the commish as well … both could WELL be out on the street homeless and unemployed.

One suspects he can see the handwriting on the wall more clearly than those disgruntled sheep he is attempting to shepherd in unison.

And Monty pretty much showed his hand and prowess in obtaining “hard” information … its all guess work seat of the pants flying in the fog facts gathering … former football stars and even ADs are flying just as blind …

The real battles are in the BofRs and presidents closed offices … what these sports writers need are those unemployed KGB agents from the 60’s-70’s who can plant “bugs” in those same offices … :wink:

Patrick, let me assure you that nobody tells Texas what to do when it comes to their own self interest…Texas has long regarded Big 12 as DEAD MAN WALKING, and an implosion waiting to happen. If they dont get what they want then they will make some arrangement with BIG or PAC…dont ever refer to Texas as anyone’s property because they arent. ESPN merely paid them a huge amount of money for broadcast rights for LHN that clearly has proven not to be worth it…Thats THEIR lookout, not Texas’. Texas is going to go where the prestige and money is, as well as academic respectability…Texas to ACC? Dont think so…Texas has openly talked with PAC and BIG in the past and likely will do so again…BOTH conferences lust after Texas markets.

Uhhh … you have been watching too many late night women prison movies!!!

So who’s next on the 'lusting after" list??!!”

the horns or the cougars??


True, but if ESPN makes it worth their while to head East and join the ACC in order to turn the LHN into the ACC Network, I’m sure they’ll listen. ACC Network needs the enticing inventory to sell across the country and they don’t have ND football. Using Texas and BYU along with FSU and ACC Basketball will definitely ensure widespread distribution. I wouldn’t be surprised if they do go PAC12 or B1G, but I know they also want to be where Notre Dame is and the ACC is a very good academic conference. Hell, you could almost break up the ACC into old ACC vs. Big East/Texas lines.

ACC Division
North Carolina
North Carolina State
Wake Forest
Virginia Tech
Georgia Tech
Florida State

Big East/TX Division
Boston College
Notre Dame
Texas Tech

I’d take that.

You’d be better off planting them in governor’s offices. The Governors control the BOR who control the Presidents

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