Guy won without Hakeem and Elvin too. That’s a sticky argument. Does Coack K win much without all of those 5* players? I think it is what you do with what you have. CKS took over a dumpster fire and each season has gotten a little better.
hakeem wasnt some elite prospect, nor was he elite from the start, he was just a role player as a freshmen, he didnt start dominating till he got to his sophomore year…there is clear evidence that hakeem had to be developed (even the phi slama jama 30 for 30 talked about how raw he was in the beginning)
and isnt recruiting part of coaching??
lewis has 5 final 4s, 2 national championship appearances and 5 other seasons that went to atleast the sweet 16s… sampson has 1 final 4, and 2 other seasons that went to atleast the sweet 16, sampson has coached almost the same amount of seasons as did lewis
i love sampson but lets not get carried away
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Never try to compare different eras and circumstances.
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sampson is old, they have a few overlapping years…their eras werent so different…and isnt coaching about adapting to your enviorment
lewis is legend, lets no try and undermine that because of some “eras”, or he had “These players” arguments…sampson can take us to 2 final 4s in the next 5 years and we can have a legitimate conversation, right now its worlds apart
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I think that recruiting to UH during most of Guy’s years was much easier than for Sampson at present time.
Reality was that in the 60’s, 70;s and maybe early 80’s, UH was the only BB game in the state…PERIOD.
There was no ESPN and local players with talent mainly knew of UH.
NOT the case now.
JMHO
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thats not even kinda true…you need to rewatch the phi slama jama 30 for 30…they explain the difficulties
no one wanted to come to UH, guy somehow convinced rob williams to come to UH (An all-american)… that it was after rob came that many of them decided that it was okay to stay home…
and rob was the only touted player, clyde drexeler said no one wanted him, and houston fans were attacking guy for taking a chance on him, and why wasnt houston getting the touted players, like the big schools (the papers didnt even spell him name correctly when he first came)… and even clyde who wasnt a known player said he only came because he wanted to play with rob
UH wasnt the only bb game in texas…texas has never won but texas has always recruited at elite levels … there arent recruiting sites that date back to the 70’/80’s but there are lists of parade-all Americans listing where they went to college, …texas cleaned house, almost yearly
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Couldn’t disagree more…
No doubt GVL made UH a name school for BB…and recruited guys like Hayes, Cheney and Birdsong. He taught them a lot. A lot of the local talent came because they wanted to be with a winner and since they could live at home and get stipend money for room and board…helped a little also.
Hell ut, and a$m knew this…they just paid their players under the table just like today.
UT sucked at BB until Lemons got there and then they ran him off.
SWC BB was a complete joke until UH entered, then Sutton raised Arkansas. Remember that UH had to “wait” for 5 years to join that joke of a league. The other schools were slow to come around primarily because they didn’t give a damn about BB until UH went to 3 final fours. We didn’t even have to split the final 4 money…then with the $$$$ signs showing, ut changed the rules. Imagine that ! Of course, the $$$ were a lot lower when Uh was in the final 4 than today.
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The question that I ask myself is this…what would Guy Lewis had done with Sampson’s recruits and schedule and what would Sampson have done with Lewis’ recruits and schedule. Guy was a winner, but not a championship HC.
A championship coach would have come away with at least one title with six Final Four (5 NCAA = 1 NIT) attempts. I would have to think that Sampson would have won one or more championships if given the opportunity to play in six Final Fours.
EE, you can’t argue with ignorance. I think pesik has gotten UT basketball confused with football. Name s UT player that made the league between Slater Martin and Lasalle Thompson
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I am going to say that Kelvin Sampson is the best coach UH has had since Guy V. Lewis and it will be a devastating blow to the program to lose him. I truly hope that he decides to finish his career here at UH.
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Agree completely.
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i didnt want to drag on the conversation, but i counted the parada all-americans that went to houston in the 80s and those that went to texas (the best era in Houston basketball)…houston had 2 , rob william and ricki winslow…then i counted the ones that went to UT…UT had 13 … Arkansas has as many texas all-Americans as did houston…and texas wasnt just cleaning out houston they were getting all-Americans from all over the country, i saw 1 from utah and oklahoma
your nba point is a really bad one…your arent accounting for the fact that guy v lewis developed them into nba players…again no one wanted clyde…and hakeem wasnt that touted a recruit
when they were finished with guy, after 3 years of developing from hall of fame legend guy v lewis, they were all american…
texas was a 5star grave yard in basketball in the 80s and they are a 5star graveyard today, not sure why its that hard for you to believe, when its still happening today…they had 8 all-american on their team last year and were subpar at best…
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you guys are saying i’m arguing with ignorance, when by the words of those around the program in the 80s houston struggled at recruiting (it has been stated in numerous phi slama jama documentires not just the 30 for 30, that it was rob that changed the tide)
and the fact that there are tons of sites that record parade all-americans and what school they went to…
you are the ones arguing with ignorance, what is your evidence…guy v lewis DEVELOPED ALL OF THOSE PLAYERS, so any nba point is a bad one …
you literally said a coach with 5 final 4s is worse than a guy with 1
i love sampson but lets not disrespect guy in the process
Why are you limiting your arguement to the "80’s GVL lasted only till 86. He started in 1956 I believe.
Prior to the 80’s ut sucked BIG TIME !!..As did ALL SWC schools when it came to BB.
You are too focused on a 4 year span.
the database i used to compile only went back to the mid 70’s (we didnt get any in the mid 70’s) so i just stuck to the strongest era in UH basketball, give me a sec ill look for some the mid 60’s (the elvin era)
First, I don’t need to watch the 30 for 30. I’ve followed UH basketball since the early 60s. Season ticketholder since 1972. Second, please name the 13 Parade AAs UT signed in the 70s. From the 50s thru early 80s I can name 3 NBA players from UT - Slater Martin, Johnny Moore and Lasalle Thompson.
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here is an article about how houston got its stars in the 60’s
elvin and don chaney both with a 3rd lesser known player weren’t even from Texas
neither don chaney or elvin hayes were that touted, and guy actually wanted don more, elvin wasnt touted at all…elvin wanted to go to a small time school, but his mother was big into social activism and wanted her son to play a part in integration…
so the 3 biggest players in houston history werent touted at all, and all developed into to superstars…but you guys are selling a narrative that guy was plucking all Americans with ease…discrediting that guy developed them
80s*
and these are the ones from texas
John Brownlee
Lance Blanks
David Butler
Jonathan Edwards
Carlton Cooper
Alex Broadway (part of bmw)
Travis Mays (part of bmw) * the w wasn’t a touted recruit
Coyle Winborn
Albert Burditt
random fact since the mr basketball award started a half century ago, cedric alley jr last year is the only one to pick houston
and i found a list of the parade all americans from tx for the early 1960s when elvin was being recruited, all were actually from the houston area, not a single one picked houston
Ricky Kaminsky chose yale
Darrell Hardy chose baylor
the first phi slama jama final 4 was carried by a super touted recruit in rob williams, but the other 4 final 4s where carried by a bunch of recruits that werent touted in any sense of the word,but you guys are legitimately selling a narrative that it wasnt guy and his development …okay
I am going to the football and baseball topics, and pretend Cougars are not really discussing this lame of a topic. Feel free to get after me, I will never see it.
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There are dozens and dozens of college coaches capable of coaching at higher paying posts. They are simply happy where they are. Not all are NBA capable but many could go elsewhere for more cash.
Sometimes coaches just find a place that works for them. Kelvin gets his shiny new gym next year, a nice raise, gets to tutor his son as his replacement in the city he’s called home for quite a while. And he knows he can win here.
And the expectations and pressures are only a fraction of what they were at Indiana and Oklahoma.
Could this place just be where he was meant to end his career? I think maybe so.
I’ve just never felt that frenetic “I’m the sh#@#@…look at me” vibe around Kelvin that you got from Herman.
I also don’t recall one single negative article about Sampson from the Houston press since he took the job. A fact that’s probably not lost on him and his family.
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