OT: Why didn't Texas State ever become a powerhouse football program?

Football
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Living on campus simply isn’t more expensive as a general rule.

As I said, people that want to save money can either a) live at home with their parents freshman year, or b) go to juco that first year.

They’ll spend more, on average, living off campus and not with their parents than they would on campus as a full-time freshman.

That’s why I consider arguments against the mandate to be so BOGUS.

Whitmire’s arguments, of course, were crap. One is no longer valid, since gays can now marry, and it really wasn’t valid even then, simply because gays could always be roommates in the dorms. And his line about Hispanic families, that’s a really BULLCRAP ethnic stereotype. If a person has to resort to stereotyping in order to make a case, as Whitmire did, then he/she simply doesn’t have a case.

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Again, one would think it would be easier to cope if you’ve centralized your live- study- work- social life environment to ONE centralized place.

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You can’t say that with a straight face when I gave you real numbers months ago about places to live within 5 miles of the UH campus that were less expensive than living in all, but one of the dorms

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Because that’s not where the vast majority of those off campus students are living.

Trust me. When I was in law school, most of those other law students were living in places that were WAY MORE expensive (Galleria, Med Center, etc), and they ended up way deeper in debt.

That’s why I can say it with a straight face. Because I KNOW the truth!

Anyway, even College Factual gives on campus housing at UH a slight edge, expense wise.

So based on that, I stand by what I said.

$15,817 for off campus per year, all expenses considered, versus $15,378 for on campus.

As I said, expense is a BOGUS argument against the mandate.

And because it is, Whitmire had to resort to even MORE BOGUS stereotyping.

Hopefully you won’t go there as well and will simply stand corrected.

Now then, to give some consideration to what YOU said about places within five miles, that are cheaper. Hell, a little farther out, can certainly find garage apartments in the Heights that are cheaper. A small percentage of my law school classmates did. But most did not.

That doesn’t mean anything. On average, you’re probably going to pay comparable or more.

I’m sure you can find a place that’s cheaper in some cases, but ON AVERAGE that’s not the case. And given how much less likely you are to graduate/graduate on time as an off-campus undergraduate student, encouraging such a commuter population is only going to HURT UH when it comes to being a Top 50 public and AAU member.

Given that, why would YOU advocate such a thing?

As I said, that’s dumb.

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I’ll trust your 20 year old anecdote about graduate students but I’ve dealt with current undergraduate students who tell me where they live.

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Also, not sure when UH jacked up the Houston cost, but when I attended in the early 2000s, dorm rates were $250-$350 a bed/ month.

With that said, housing rates have skyrocketed everywhere. What does a 1 bedroom apartment run you inside the loop these days ? $1,500…$2,000/ month.

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Given the layout of Houston, I don’t really see how it even matters if students live on campus-sponsored housing.

Unless you are an out of state or don’t have reliable transportation, living in the medical center, EaDo, Third Ward, Midtown, Upper Kirby, or even the Heights, is still relatively in proximity to the University of Houston (and Rice).

If you have the financial support to live in an offsite apartment, you most likely also have a car. Which lends to most likely attending on-campus events if it’s merely a 10-15 minute drive away.

As far as the students that are commuting all the way from Katy, Sugarland, Cypress, Aldine, or any suburb outside of the 610 loop, now that’s a different story.

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Good.

Then look to a third party source like college factual.

That data is on MY side, not yours.

Given that, I reject your hearsay from whoever is telling you that.

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As I said, you can find a garage apartment in the Heights that is cheaper. About the only law students that did better than I did, housing expense wise, were those people.

Living in a lot of those other places tends to be more expensive. Perhaps the third ward is cheaper, but I’d rather live on campus than next door in the heart of the third ward.

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UT surprisingly showed some mercy and didn’t make them become UT-Nacogdoches or put orange in their colors.

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What hearsay? I gave examples of rental property available. Actual facts from actual places to rent that are actually less expensive than UH housing.

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You said there were students telling you where they live.

Hearsay.

Come up with a neutral third party data source, as I did, to support your contention that it’s generally cheaper to live off-campus. I can assure you, you won’t find any.

I’m sure you can find anecdotal/exceptional examples of people that live significantly cheaper off campus; even I could (see the garage apartments in the Heights example that I gave).

But in general, that’s not the case. Anecdotal examples don’t disprove the averages.

I’m sure you showed me a few such exceptional examples when you did.

But again…in general, that’s NOT the case, and that’s why your case cannot be made and your arguments ineffective. Exceptions don’t disprove the general rule.

Expense simply isn’t an effective argument against a freshman housing mandate.

That’s why Whitmire had to use the EVEN MORE BOGUS arguments that he did (i.e., IGNORANT stereotyping).

The real problem that our school still suffers from, to a degree, is that there are too many people who are dead set on making UH more like Cleveland State (which is widely regarded as mediocre), than like UCLA or Pitt (which are more elite).

I don’t really understand that mindset; I figure everyone would want us to have the highest ranking and best reputation possible.

I can assure you that you will NOT achieve it by following the Cleveland State model.

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They told me the areas where they live then I showed you rents in those areas.
Look for yourself

HAR shows 79 properties around UH for less than $1k a month. That doesn’t include apartment complexes.

Proof beyond reasonable doubt.

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In a 9 month school year, that’s still not significantly better than living on campus.

And you still have to tack on the costs of gasoline, oil changes, etc., which would be avoided by living on campus.

All in all, NO better, possibly worse.

And again, you’re relying on HEARSAY. If you had a study that incorporated a significant sample size of UH students, it’d be different. You relied on anecdotal hearsay from a small number of students that may not be representative.

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Quit saying hearsay when I’m providing real world numbers. There’s at least 29 properties for $800.

Cheaper than living on campus.

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Add in the costs of gasoline and oil changes.

And the cost of utilities.

And again, those are EXCEPTIONS. You can always find anecdotal EXCEPTIONS. Even I could (garage apartments in the Heights).

Those exceptions don’t disprove the general rules or averages.

Why do you insist that we be Cleveland State, Houston campus, instead of striving to be more like UCLA or Pitt?

Seems DUMB to me!

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There’s enough exceptions that your statement that it’s cheaper to live on campus is proven false. You simply want students to pay more and possibly get themselves into debt.

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Except that it isn’t, because we are talking about IN GENERAL.

NOT exceptions. You’re providing exceptions. I’m talking in general.

Even I know that there are EXCEPTIONS. I even presented exceptions. Exceptions don’t prove anything.

But in general, NO. In general, and on average, it’s less expensive to live on campus.

Stop insisting that we be Cleveland State.

Strive instead to be more like UCLA or Pitt.

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You’ve been proven wrong. Accept it. If you keep saying otherwise then your motive is simply to increase cost for students.

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Comparing to 2x occupancy like on campus, wouldn’t we have to divide by 2 to get apples to apples, so like $400 per month?