I don’t know if I necessarily agree but more and more people from soccer loving countries have/are moving here, so I’m sure there is merit to your point.
1 Like
Your own sited stat says 2.5 million for the Stanley Cup not average NHL games. I’ll be happy to compare World Cup numbers if you want to compare marquee events. The NHL may also add up to 2.5 million people for local broadcast. That’s a fair comparison. However, than I’ll add the 600,000 for LigaMX, and the 1,000,000 people watching their local MLS teams on Apple+. Those two alone get to 2.8 million and I haven’t even added up Serie A, Ligue 1 or National teams.
Also, try again on your average attendance comparison between the NHL and MLS. In 2024, the NHL averaged 17,443. MLS averaged 23,234.
You want to note NASCAR’s “'neck” following. A big missing element for many are the 66 million Hispanics that make up 19% of the population in this country. A population where an argument could be made that soccer is the #1 sport.
I’m not here to poop on the NHL or hockey. IMO, the NHL has the best playoffs in sports. It probably was #4 15-20 years ago. As an individual league, it is #4. Hockey as an overall sport, not anymore.
The NHL finals drew over 2.5 million versus less than 500K for the MLS finals.
NOT close.
Total attendance for the NHL is over 24 million compared to only 12 million for MLS. Of course average attendance is higher for the MLS because they play in larger outdoor venues, but in total attendance, the NHL buries the MLS. Size of venue and average per game doesn’t necessarily reflect overall popularity.
Overall attendance, again, NOT CLOSE.
And once again, since you didn’t get the math, ESPN usually broadcasts more than one NHL game per week, which amounts to more than 900K viewers. TNT gets another 440K for its weekly broadcasts.
That’s more than ALL pro soccer viewership in the USA regardless of league with only THREE games (1.3+ versus 1.2 million).
Add in viewership from local broadcasts, and viewership from ESPN+, which broadcasts several NHL games per week, and the NHL is likely MILLIONS ahead in viewership over pro soccer in the USA.
Again….NOT close.
Soccer is no better than #5 in the USA, likely number six behind NASCAR thanks to the redn*cks.
Anyone telling you otherwise is either lying or misinformed.
And for reasons previously discussed, that isn’t likely to change during our lifetimes.
I dont hate soccer.
I watch both all of US and Italia’s National matches.
I even watched a Euro Cup Final in a Piazza, in Rome.
But the reality is Americans HATE soccer.
I watched last year as team USA played in the Copa de Americas in a HALF EMPTY Arrowhead Stadium
1 Like
Here is how I see different sports tiers of popularity in the US:
Tier 1: NFL by far
Tier 2: NBA, MLB, NCAA Football
Tier 3: NHL (borderline 2 especially in playoffs), Men’s NCAA basketball (definite 2 during tourney, probably 4 during regular season), F1, NASCAR, UFC, EPL and other top European soccer club teams
Tier 4: MLS, Indycar (bumps for Indy 500 that’s it), Golf (bumps much higher for a week during majors), Caitlin Clark - not WNBA - Caitlin Clark.
Tier 5: Everything else like professional bowling, UFL, minor league baseball, pro lacrosse, WNBA, women’s college softball and basketball, etc…
Special event sporting events are kind of their own thing. They get really popular for about 5 min then poof are gone. Olympics, Triple Crown Horse races, World Cup, etc…
The problem with MLS is twofold - with their Apple TV deal they are out of sight and out of mind which is a terrible place to be since they aren’t popular enough to be sought out by the masses. Also they will never be a TOP world league and probably not even top 5. Americans are used to having the best. All our other sports are the ‘best’ in the world and since they aren’t close there will always be a minor league/bush league mentality about them from the average American sports fan. MLS could maybe move to tier 3 but that’s their peak but even tier 3 is a crowded sports field so the chance they are ever a top 5 league to the American sports fan is very very minimal.
Personally I watch NFL, NCAA Football, Men’s Basketball (UH), and golf the most but I will pretty much dabble in any competitive sport including bowling and Australian Rules Football which comes on FS2 at my house sometimes and I watch some soccer too - just watched Inter Miami game last night which was awesome
1 Like
Americans don’t hate soccer they are just meh about it until its the WC. Just like the olympics, Americans tune in and cheer for T&F, Swimming and gynastics and one would think there would be support for a pro league. But in non olympics years people do not tune in to watch in meaningful numbers, that is where soccer stands.
Now, regarding the MLS its growth looks like a dot.com type scenario and in time it will likely pop when they run out of markets and people willing to pay in excess of 600 million for a franchise.
Again, you are comparing leagues. I am comparing sports. I concede that NHL is bigger than MLS. You’re right it’s not close. However, you are vastly underrating the soccer watching audience in this country. If you want to go week by week hockey vs soccer, I’ll be glad to. I’ll be happy to add weekday EPL and European league matches, National team soccer, the Champions League.
I don’t know why you are stuck on this 1.2 M soccer number when that is just the EPL, LaLiga and Bundesliga on any given Saturday. I added MLS and LigaMX and got to 2.8M with those on a single Saturday. Let’s go through an entire week when you add weekday league games, or especially Champions League matches and it’s much higher.
You want to bring up 'Necks but don’t want to acknowledge the 66 million Hispanics in this country who primarily would consider soccer their number 1 sport. Above the NFL, NBA and MLB.
You mention the garbage attendance for the USA in Copa America. The USMNT is “going through things” and is definitely disappointing attendance wise, and on the field. However, just look at other international matches in Houston. Mexico routinely sells out NRG when they play here and you can name numerous Central American countries and clubs that will sell out Shell Energy Stadium and/or predominately fill NRG. Same happens in Dallas, San Antonio, Phoenix, LA, NYC, Chicago and other “international cities”.
For WasSoonerNowCoogs post, he lists in Tier 3: EPL and other European sports. MLS is Tier 4. As individual leagues, that is a fair analysis. However, I’m again talking about sports and not leagues. That also doesn’t include National Team soccer, Women’s soccer or LigaMX as examples. I would put National Team soccer (again not just the USMNT or USWNT, but all countries) as a Tier 3. Combine all of those, I will still put those ahead between Tier 2 and 3 on this list.
You want to talk about attendance?
Do you?
How many games is a regular NHL season?
82 games
How many games is a regular MLS season?
I will ask again. How many regular MLS games are played by season?
34 games.
Yes, 34 games.
ENOUGH SAID…bro.
PRINT IT.
Compare the venue capacity percentage and TV ratings and get back to me.
NHL is the world’s fifth largest professional sports league by revenue.
MLS is tenth.
Not close Bro.
Soccer is either #5 or #6 in the USA.
These Soccer Apologists Crack me up.
Yes, 100%, it is easily the most popular sport wirldwide but it just doesn’t resinate with Americans…they’ve been trying HARD since the 70s /80s when they brought Pele over and marketed the crap out of him.
Its justba different type of sport. Americans have chosen not to go back to the rotary phone (Soccer) since they have the latest smartphone (NFL Football) and its not even close.
Americans want creativity that leads to scoring…not a NIL NIL.
Again, i say this as someone whose watched hundreds of matches
Get back to you bro?
I got back to you. You can’t accept facts law. The facts were given to you and you try to move around the facts by writing the soccer venues are bigger. Well buddy boy you have to fill these stadiums. Oh wait you wrote that soccer attendance sucked.
Try again, you fell on your own argument.
Defendant wins. Yes you have to pay the court fees as well as performing community service. Jump suit is over there.
You watched?
What happened?
Didn’t say it sucked, but it’s only half that of the NHL.
That’s a FACT that YOU don’t seem willing to accept.
And MLS, is well behind the NHL in TV ratings and revenues.
NHL is big enough to be on ESPN and TNT weekly. MLS is on dang Apple TV.
Those are also FACTS.
Again, soccer, including MLS, is #5 AT BEST in the USA, and even lower if you count FBS football, D1 basketball as separate categories, and NASCAR.
Sorry if you don’t want to accept those facts.
Not wanting to accept the facts doesn’t change them.
I know it is late for you but you can’t even count. Do the math. It is not that hard
Remember 82 games vs 34.
Yeah, so?
Which league has more sellouts, higher revenues, better TV ratings, and better TV deals in the USA?
Hint: NHL.
Again, MLS is behind even college football, college basketball, and NASCAR, and soccer as a whole no better than #5.
I wonder if more kids in America play Soccer or Hockey?
Probably soccer.
But that is neither here nor there.
Soccer is well behind as a spectator/viewer sport in the USA.
You can’t reason with him.
He brings up attendance.
I bring up black and white facts.
He can’t accept facts. He is not even realizing what he is posting.
Yes, i watch but I can definitely understand why most Americans say the sport is boring AF.
The US National Team is very frustrating to watch at times.
They play with very little passion…almost scared on the bigger stages.
Ive been watching them for most of my life
Renember this:
Oliver Luck caved because the franchise had such a small “non-hispanic” following.
By comparison, the Philadelphia 76ers have YET to change their name in fear they would offend English- Americans